I’m a noise junkie. I used to be a news junkie, but I’ve hung out with the world’s top journalists enough now to see that the good ones are noise junkies. They are the types that head into a crowded party and listen to pitch after pitch (noise) and drunken story after drunken story (noise) to find something that their audiences will find interesting (news). I’m not the only one who likes the noise: Hutch Carpenter defends the noise too.
Last year I got a tour of the Wall Street Journal’s West Coast printing plant. They print 60,000 copies an hour. At the end of the tour the head pressman said “I’ve been reading this six hours before you did for more than 15 years now and it hasn’t helped yet.” Why? Cause the news isn’t where the action is: the high value bits are stuck in the noise.
I’ve been studying noise and news now for quite a while. I’ve been wondering why sites like Google News and TechMeme have no, or little, noise? Tomorrow I’ll tour the New York Times headquarters in New York to pick up even more tips of how they make sure noise doesn’t sneak onto its pages.
First, let’s do a little definition of the difference between news and noise. The noise examples were pulled off of Twitter in the past few minutes.
NEWS: tens of thousands dead in China quake.
NOISE: BrianGreene: some pirate is playing old radio nova tapes on 92FM dublin, with old jingles and old ads. adverts for rent a 20″ TV 48p a day (48 pence!)
NEWS: Janitors go on strike.
NOISE: flawlesswalrus: @craigmod Iron Man’s fun times. Enjoy!
NEWS: Facebook blocks Google
NOISE: dmkanter: organizing my igoogle homepage
So, how come services like Twitter and FriendFeed have so much noise? Who likes the noise? Who likes the news?
I like the noise. Why? Because I can see patterns before anyone else. I saw the Chinese earthquake happening 45 minutes before Google News reported it. Why? Because I was watching the noise, not the news.
Let me ask you something. Do you think Walt Mossberg will wake up tomorrow and worry about what’s on TechMeme or Google News, or will he sit through yet another boring PR pitch from some gadget company trying to find something unique to tell his readers?
The news is in the noise. Which is why Twitter is crack for newsmakers. There’s no better place to find noise, er news, than on Twitter. Even on FriendFeed there’s less noise than there is on Twitter (if you subscribe to both). Why? Because of the “Hide” link and clustering. I can put 156 Tweets in my Twitter follower’s faces, blocking all other Twitterers from getting to their pages. But on FriendFeed? All my Tweets are clustered together and blocked from view unless you expand them to read them all.
So, anyway, how does Google News and Techmeme keep the noise from hitting their pages?
Google News: Only tracks sites that have “teams” of people working on them. That usually means there’s an organized effort. That alone blocks 99.9% of bloggers and Twitterers from even being considered.
TechMeme: requires multiple “votes” by an elite to get on the page. Even a link from TechCrunch (which is the #1 “voter” on TechMeme) won’t get you onto Techmeme. You’ve gotta have something else to go with that link.
Google News: the more “big city newspapers and news sources” that cover something, the more likely that story will get to the home page.
TechMeme: watches signaling from key members on Twitter and Google Reader. If enough people who are on the TechMeme Leaderboard Twitter and share an item on Google Reader you’ll see the item pulled onto the page.
Both Google News and Techmeme: only stuff in past 24 hours gets onto the page.
What differentiates Techmeme and Google News? Google News only considers news from news teams (mostly, only a few blogs are there among hundreds of thousands of newspapers, TV stations, magazines, and news blogs like Huffington Post). Techmeme? Looks at Twitter and Google Reader for signaling mechanisms (what news is getting hot) but mostly considers blog posts and professional journalism that have gotten the attention of a limited number of “elite” bloggers/journalists. Techmeme gets news from sources that aren’t always professionally run sites, which is the biggest differentiator. Techmeme could be said to have more noise than Google News, which is what makes it more interesting than Google News — to me. To my dad? I bet he’d like Google News better because it only has news, no noise.
The problem with both Google News and Techmeme? New ideas and new people won’t get onto the page easily. You have to convince multiple people who control these sites that your stuff is important. In Google News’ case you’ll probably have to publish your news on a site that already is added to Google News’ database. That’s one reason why I see Dave Winer’s stuff only when he writes for Huffington Post show up there. Convincing someone like Huffington Post that you’re important enough to publish is pretty hard and takes building up a reputation and an audience of your own.
If you’re looking for new faces and new conversations that haven’t yet gotten to be important enough to get onto Google News or Techmeme, then FriendFeed and Twitter are far better places to hang out.
Getting on TechMeme? You better convince someone near the top of the TechMeme leader board (getting me to link to you doesn’t really matter unless someone in the top five also links to you) to talk about you and link to you. That’s really hard. Why? Cause we don’t agree on what’s important. You can see that come out in last Friday’s Gillmor Gang. Heck, we’re yelling at each other on the phone. You think we’re going to decide to link to you? Hah!
I know Google News and TechMeme will get more of a mainstream audience because all they report is news, but excuse me if I spend a lot more time over on Twitter and FriendFeed swimming in the noise.
Scobleizer 
So you might say you’re a trendspotter?
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So you might say you’re a trendspotter?
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Strong summary, Robert. I bet Gabe might disagree with some of your inferences to the Techmeme methodology, but the underlying element, saying you need to subscribe to what’s called “noise” in Twitter or FriendFeed is right. To me, it’s not necessarily noise, but it’s definitely raw. This raw data is what feeds the more polished, approved by PR, edited, summaries you’ll somewhere else later.
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Strong summary, Robert. I bet Gabe might disagree with some of your inferences to the Techmeme methodology, but the underlying element, saying you need to subscribe to what’s called “noise” in Twitter or FriendFeed is right. To me, it’s not necessarily noise, but it’s definitely raw. This raw data is what feeds the more polished, approved by PR, edited, summaries you’ll somewhere else later.
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Hey Robert,
As you know, I am a BIG fan of Twitter and that’s because like you, I find the ‘noise’ of Twitter massively valuable. I was chatting with you when the China Earthquake news broke across Twitter. It was amazing how the picture of the disaster made its way through ‘the noise’ – It was a little like watching a photograph develop in a darkroom!
We are in the midst of a real change in the way that news is both broken AND reported. The coming 12 months are certainly going to be interesting (for us bloggers anyway!)
Jim Connolly
The Tech News Blog
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Hey Robert,
As you know, I am a BIG fan of Twitter and that’s because like you, I find the ‘noise’ of Twitter massively valuable. I was chatting with you when the China Earthquake news broke across Twitter. It was amazing how the picture of the disaster made its way through ‘the noise’ – It was a little like watching a photograph develop in a darkroom!
We are in the midst of a real change in the way that news is both broken AND reported. The coming 12 months are certainly going to be interesting (for us bloggers anyway!)
Jim Connolly
The Tech News Blog
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Well said, Robert! For me you are noise,…. hope!
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Well said, Robert! For me you are noise,…. hope!
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I’ve come full circle on this and have turned up the noise (a lot) lately. Someday, we’ll have ‘easy filters’. For now, it works for me in a variety of ways. Agree with Jim. The next 12 months will be VERY dynamic. There was a lot of logic to the CBS / CNET acquisition. Now, it’s up to them to be ‘early adopters’ and make it work.
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I’ve come full circle on this and have turned up the noise (a lot) lately. Someday, we’ll have ‘easy filters’. For now, it works for me in a variety of ways. Agree with Jim. The next 12 months will be VERY dynamic. There was a lot of logic to the CBS / CNET acquisition. Now, it’s up to them to be ‘early adopters’ and make it work.
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There is one major point being missed in this argument. There is a higher standard used to filter out news because some companies are reputation based and do not want to minimize rumors from getting out of hand.
Use the Twitter / China rumor as example. It may turn out that it was just Entertainment sites being shut down – but because of one Twitter, information about memorial sites being shut down made it to one the the most visited blogs on Technorati. Which means it will make its way to many other sources.
We need higher standards for prestigious organizations because of their effect and footprint on society.
Twitter is just two friends gossiping – while reputable news sources want info from reliable sources and substantiation
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There is one major point being missed in this argument. There is a higher standard used to filter out news because some companies are reputation based and do not want to minimize rumors from getting out of hand.
Use the Twitter / China rumor as example. It may turn out that it was just Entertainment sites being shut down – but because of one Twitter, information about memorial sites being shut down made it to one the the most visited blogs on Technorati. Which means it will make its way to many other sources.
We need higher standards for prestigious organizations because of their effect and footprint on society.
Twitter is just two friends gossiping – while reputable news sources want info from reliable sources and substantiation
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Great post Robert!
I have to say i love the noise too. If you wait for the news to pick things up you are way behind the curve and trying to catch up. The Internet is like the stock market. The REAL money is made by the people who MADE the stock move not the guy who read about it in the Wall Street Journal.
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Great post Robert!
I have to say i love the noise too. If you wait for the news to pick things up you are way behind the curve and trying to catch up. The Internet is like the stock market. The REAL money is made by the people who MADE the stock move not the guy who read about it in the Wall Street Journal.
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SearchEngines: you missed that that post has already been updated and corrected. So anyone who repeated the early news without looking at the noise in my comments will make a huge mistake. The noise +is+ self correcting — if you listen to the noise.
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SearchEngines: you missed that that post has already been updated and corrected. So anyone who repeated the early news without looking at the noise in my comments will make a huge mistake. The noise +is+ self correcting — if you listen to the noise.
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There’s a fairly well-dressed guy who regularly comes to the car wash next to the gym where I work out. What’s interesting about him is what he does there: he goes through the garbage cans next to the car vacuum cleaners. Turns out he’s look for change that people vacuum out when cleaning their cars. He’s not getting rich doing it, but he finds enough to keep him coming back.
I’m not suggesting that Scoble’s talking about going through the informational garbage here. But sometimes the ratio of noise/trash to nuggets might seem like it.
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There’s a fairly well-dressed guy who regularly comes to the car wash next to the gym where I work out. What’s interesting about him is what he does there: he goes through the garbage cans next to the car vacuum cleaners. Turns out he’s look for change that people vacuum out when cleaning their cars. He’s not getting rich doing it, but he finds enough to keep him coming back.
I’m not suggesting that Scoble’s talking about going through the informational garbage here. But sometimes the ratio of noise/trash to nuggets might seem like it.
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Great post Robert. You’ve put a lot behaviors we’ve seen from certain early adopters into context.
Louis: indeed, some of Robert’s inferences are wrong since reverse engineering Techmeme is tricky. Overall, Robert continues to be rather savvy about Techmeme.
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Great post Robert. You’ve put a lot behaviors we’ve seen from certain early adopters into context.
Louis: indeed, some of Robert’s inferences are wrong since reverse engineering Techmeme is tricky. Overall, Robert continues to be rather savvy about Techmeme.
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Gabe is right. Reverse engineering TechMeme is indeed tricky. How many hundreds of thousands of lines of code are there? But, interesting that since this week I got Mike Arrington and crew to both fight with me and link to me I’ve been on TechMeme several times. 🙂
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Gabe is right. Reverse engineering TechMeme is indeed tricky. How many hundreds of thousands of lines of code are there? But, interesting that since this week I got Mike Arrington and crew to both fight with me and link to me I’ve been on TechMeme several times. 🙂
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You know Robert, this is a very interesting post. I think you hit the nail on the head. I’ve been feeling like there is a lot of noise all around. Between Twitter, FF, FaceBook, StumbleUpon, etc. I don’t know how people who don’t have full time jobs can keep up.
I finally came to the conclusion, I’m not a noise junky, I’m a news junky. I look for useful news that is a little ahead of mainstream and attempt to apply it.
Bottom line, you have talent in sorting the noise; I have talents in finding useful applications for news… I think I’m fine with that – at least for my own sanity!
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You know Robert, this is a very interesting post. I think you hit the nail on the head. I’ve been feeling like there is a lot of noise all around. Between Twitter, FF, FaceBook, StumbleUpon, etc. I don’t know how people who don’t have full time jobs can keep up.
I finally came to the conclusion, I’m not a noise junky, I’m a news junky. I look for useful news that is a little ahead of mainstream and attempt to apply it.
Bottom line, you have talent in sorting the noise; I have talents in finding useful applications for news… I think I’m fine with that – at least for my own sanity!
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Very thought provoking concept. I never thought about there being value in noise, in this way. Now, yes, I like noise.
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Very thought provoking concept. I never thought about there being value in noise, in this way. Now, yes, I like noise.
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I’m voting for the News over the Noise.
And I’m also asking: what did knowing about the Chinese earthquake minutes before other folks… contribute to your life? Seriously. Did it help you in a great way? Was it highly useful? Greatly entertaining? Extra meaningful?
I think folks (including myself sometimes) should step back and ask: how much does what you call “noise” contribute to the overall, long-term quality of our lives? And how much does it keep us mildly entertained and too busy to follow through on meaningful, long-term products?
You may know about the next great Web 2.0 company even days before others, but is playing with the Latest Great Thing for a few extra days going to change your life?
Perspective. Perspective.
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I’m voting for the News over the Noise.
And I’m also asking: what did knowing about the Chinese earthquake minutes before other folks… contribute to your life? Seriously. Did it help you in a great way? Was it highly useful? Greatly entertaining? Extra meaningful?
I think folks (including myself sometimes) should step back and ask: how much does what you call “noise” contribute to the overall, long-term quality of our lives? And how much does it keep us mildly entertained and too busy to follow through on meaningful, long-term products?
You may know about the next great Web 2.0 company even days before others, but is playing with the Latest Great Thing for a few extra days going to change your life?
Perspective. Perspective.
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>Did it help you in a great way?
Yes. It helped cement my reputation as being a person who is early with news. It also got me interviewed by the Associated Press, was in the BBC, and NPR is still hanging out. Not that that really matters in the grand scheme of things. The earthquake was one small example that really didn’t matter to my life all that much (other than if I had relatives or friends there I would have been able to maybe get through before phone lines became jammed).
But on being first to see new tech companies or new tech trends? That absolutely affects me and my ability to remain part of the conversation about this industry and where it’s going. Plus it lets me build relationships with people who then invite me over for interviews.
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>Did it help you in a great way?
Yes. It helped cement my reputation as being a person who is early with news. It also got me interviewed by the Associated Press, was in the BBC, and NPR is still hanging out. Not that that really matters in the grand scheme of things. The earthquake was one small example that really didn’t matter to my life all that much (other than if I had relatives or friends there I would have been able to maybe get through before phone lines became jammed).
But on being first to see new tech companies or new tech trends? That absolutely affects me and my ability to remain part of the conversation about this industry and where it’s going. Plus it lets me build relationships with people who then invite me over for interviews.
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Robert one thing I think you get wrong about Techmeme, I don’t think Techcrunch is the #1 vote.
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Robert one thing I think you get wrong about Techmeme, I don’t think Techcrunch is the #1 vote.
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Andy: it sure is. It’s the top of TechMeme’s Leader Board at http://www.techmeme.com/lb — the algorithms treat that board more importantly than any other factor.
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Andy: it sure is. It’s the top of TechMeme’s Leader Board at http://www.techmeme.com/lb — the algorithms treat that board more importantly than any other factor.
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Say what ?
Google News: Only tracks sites that have “teams” of people working on them. That usually means there’s an organized effort. That alone blocks 99.9% of bloggers and Twitterers from even being considered.
We have 5 authors. Each time we ask to be added in Google News, we are declined. They do not even check our News Site (even on a Google Domain). So this statement (above) is totally incorrect.
2ndly, Google has published nudity in the Google news. We wrote about that earlier …
and lastly , we are about to break a story were other services offered by Google do promote sex (not intentionally to be assured). Watch for that update as well. (Yes we will provide proof)
Techmeme is okay. Very similar to Megite as they seem to run the same stories …
I say one thing for Google News , each time we write about them , there is an immediate reaction from Google. Meaning : Now there is no more nudity in Google News, but we are finding it else where easily in the Google Domain.
They are trying yes, plugging each hole as they find them (or we do). Email-ing Google is useless, it is better to write about it.
I will try to include in our news this week where all the flaws are in Google & where. Perhaps this will spike your “NOISE” ….
Robert, this was indeed a great story. Keep up the Good work !
Lynn
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Say what ?
Google News: Only tracks sites that have “teams” of people working on them. That usually means there’s an organized effort. That alone blocks 99.9% of bloggers and Twitterers from even being considered.
We have 5 authors. Each time we ask to be added in Google News, we are declined. They do not even check our News Site (even on a Google Domain). So this statement (above) is totally incorrect.
2ndly, Google has published nudity in the Google news. We wrote about that earlier …
and lastly , we are about to break a story were other services offered by Google do promote sex (not intentionally to be assured). Watch for that update as well. (Yes we will provide proof)
Techmeme is okay. Very similar to Megite as they seem to run the same stories …
I say one thing for Google News , each time we write about them , there is an immediate reaction from Google. Meaning : Now there is no more nudity in Google News, but we are finding it else where easily in the Google Domain.
They are trying yes, plugging each hole as they find them (or we do). Email-ing Google is useless, it is better to write about it.
I will try to include in our news this week where all the flaws are in Google & where. Perhaps this will spike your “NOISE” ….
Robert, this was indeed a great story. Keep up the Good work !
Lynn
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i now rarely use techcrunch. at one time, it was far more useful than it is these days. unfortunately, it’s filled with a lot of random and uninteresting blather. lots of techcrunch stuff where there’s much bleating but precious little reporting. i prefer rss and igoogle to find out what’s happening.
too bad because gabe rivera had a good thing going for a while.
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i now rarely use techcrunch. at one time, it was far more useful than it is these days. unfortunately, it’s filled with a lot of random and uninteresting blather. lots of techcrunch stuff where there’s much bleating but precious little reporting. i prefer rss and igoogle to find out what’s happening.
too bad because gabe rivera had a good thing going for a while.
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Well said Robert. The news is in the noise and Twitter is definitely crack!
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Well said Robert. The news is in the noise and Twitter is definitely crack!
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Noise is for people with time to waste.
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Noise is for people with time to waste.
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“Twitter is crack for newsmakers” = priceless!! ha, ha!
“FriendFeed” is crack for me! (everday geek!)
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“Twitter is crack for newsmakers” = priceless!! ha, ha!
“FriendFeed” is crack for me! (everday geek!)
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Scoble, you are utterly worthless. All the articles of yours and Arrington thrown my way, and not once have you added 1 lumen of insight. Seriously, it’s to the point of absurdity now. If you didn’t have the constant psychological need to force yourself onto everyone’s radar, maybe we’d get at least something out of this social-web discussion. Of all the quality personas we’ve had in web leadership positions, I can’t think of anyone less deserving than you (two).
Please go on a long holiday, and discover some qualities worth sharing.
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Scoble, you are utterly worthless. All the articles of yours and Arrington thrown my way, and not once have you added 1 lumen of insight. Seriously, it’s to the point of absurdity now. If you didn’t have the constant psychological need to force yourself onto everyone’s radar, maybe we’d get at least something out of this social-web discussion. Of all the quality personas we’ve had in web leadership positions, I can’t think of anyone less deserving than you (two).
Please go on a long holiday, and discover some qualities worth sharing.
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I prefer selective noise over plain old news. In other words I decide which topics are of interest to me and follow only those, noise and news. That is more efficient than just noise, which can sometimes drive you crazy (at least it does that to me).
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I prefer selective noise over plain old news. In other words I decide which topics are of interest to me and follow only those, noise and news. That is more efficient than just noise, which can sometimes drive you crazy (at least it does that to me).
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recently i’ve been ‘track’ing one word on twitter. design. so anytime anyone anywhere twitters anything about the design of anything i get an instant message. (getting it going is kind of quirky – but once you do it feels way more newsy than news) Perhaps as its easy to filter out the noise. there is a personal element too – not someone paid to produce fluff – but someone interested in something enough to pull out their phone and type in 140 characters while in the midst of their friends or families or board meetings… I guess the word for design is design – at least in several languages so far…
here’s a sampling:
(wheelscore): The German Car Blog: Audi A3 Clubsport quattro: Cool design study made for W… – http://wheelscore.com/out.php?id=278161
(designcarter): Design[grin]ivide – Markup + FTP + Terminal + More = Coda = Awesomeness!: I’ve alwa.. http://tinyurl.com/658mjc
(ernohannink): Nieuw op HappyHouris Design kan ook gelukkig maken: Een leuke presentatie over ho.. http://twurl.nl/xz8mhz
(TChed): Starbucks Under fire for new logo design: http://tinyurl.com/5a3z4x
(candiluu): @jaimef Miami Vice is an excelent example of poor sound design.
(devfunnel): [design: A List Apart] Zebra Striping: Does it Really Help? http://www.alistapart.com/articles/zebrastripingdoesithelp
(askrom): I [heart] design history, but when a designer claims that today’s challenges are no different than decades ago, they just seem old and bitter.
(devfunnel): [design: COLOURlovers] When I’m Horny http://tinyurl.com/6xlhaz
(twHIVE_W20): [-O] Finishing up a CMS with an oversized design for old people in redlands …catering to old peo.. http://tinyurl.com/55wq7t
(sarahatwood): @douglassarine well, i wouldn’t recommend you get ladies underwear but if you insist the design goes in the back
(tjreo): Trying to prefer twitterific over twhirl but just can’t. Features important to me win out over beautiful design.
(melmcbride): why must they design so many women’s products with Barbie doll aesthetics? http://tinyurl.com/64r66n
(makkura): How Design ’08 opening keynote!! The fun starts now!!
Sent at 4:03 PM on Sunday
(hans_engel): New site design is live! Sorry for the stinky ‘About Me’ section – I was never good at writing those. http://is.gd/ihK
(laurict): Interior design suggestion: when building a public men’s room, don’t install highly reflective tile behind the toilet. Mildly disturbing.
(kingkool68): New blog post: Steve Jobs Cannot Design A Mouse http://tinyurl.com/5wbhkj
(kbondelli): I don’t even want to think about the hours lost in web design because Microsoft made an inferior product in IE and people choose to use it
(JamiePappas): Great post by @chrisbrogan re: blog design – check it out! http://tinyurl.com/6q5zhw
(designforum): Graphic Design Forum Dosugus cushion: Dosugus cushion looks like a black screen a.. http://tinyurl.com/5m2s2d
(wordpressjob): New job posted! WordPress blog design http://tinyurl.com/6bvnr6
(AndyLenz): schönes neues design bei meinem neuen #twitter lieblingsdienst #twitturly http://twitturly.com/
(TheJoshuaTree): I dont know why, but every-time I listen to Design Matters With Debbie Millman, I feel like a carp designer
(Beaverdale): Drinking ACME pale ale just because I like the retro-y design of the label (but it is pretty darn good beer). Every day should be like this.
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recently i’ve been ‘track’ing one word on twitter. design. so anytime anyone anywhere twitters anything about the design of anything i get an instant message. (getting it going is kind of quirky – but once you do it feels way more newsy than news) Perhaps as its easy to filter out the noise. there is a personal element too – not someone paid to produce fluff – but someone interested in something enough to pull out their phone and type in 140 characters while in the midst of their friends or families or board meetings… I guess the word for design is design – at least in several languages so far…
here’s a sampling:
(wheelscore): The German Car Blog: Audi A3 Clubsport quattro: Cool design study made for W… – http://wheelscore.com/out.php?id=278161
(designcarter): Design[grin]ivide – Markup + FTP + Terminal + More = Coda = Awesomeness!: I’ve alwa.. http://tinyurl.com/658mjc
(ernohannink): Nieuw op HappyHouris Design kan ook gelukkig maken: Een leuke presentatie over ho.. http://twurl.nl/xz8mhz
(TChed): Starbucks Under fire for new logo design: http://tinyurl.com/5a3z4x
(candiluu): @jaimef Miami Vice is an excelent example of poor sound design.
(devfunnel): [design: A List Apart] Zebra Striping: Does it Really Help? http://www.alistapart.com/articles/zebrastripingdoesithelp
(askrom): I [heart] design history, but when a designer claims that today’s challenges are no different than decades ago, they just seem old and bitter.
(devfunnel): [design: COLOURlovers] When I’m Horny http://tinyurl.com/6xlhaz
(twHIVE_W20): [-O] Finishing up a CMS with an oversized design for old people in redlands …catering to old peo.. http://tinyurl.com/55wq7t
(sarahatwood): @douglassarine well, i wouldn’t recommend you get ladies underwear but if you insist the design goes in the back
(tjreo): Trying to prefer twitterific over twhirl but just can’t. Features important to me win out over beautiful design.
(melmcbride): why must they design so many women’s products with Barbie doll aesthetics? http://tinyurl.com/64r66n
(makkura): How Design ’08 opening keynote!! The fun starts now!!
Sent at 4:03 PM on Sunday
(hans_engel): New site design is live! Sorry for the stinky ‘About Me’ section – I was never good at writing those. http://is.gd/ihK
(laurict): Interior design suggestion: when building a public men’s room, don’t install highly reflective tile behind the toilet. Mildly disturbing.
(kingkool68): New blog post: Steve Jobs Cannot Design A Mouse http://tinyurl.com/5wbhkj
(kbondelli): I don’t even want to think about the hours lost in web design because Microsoft made an inferior product in IE and people choose to use it
(JamiePappas): Great post by @chrisbrogan re: blog design – check it out! http://tinyurl.com/6q5zhw
(designforum): Graphic Design Forum Dosugus cushion: Dosugus cushion looks like a black screen a.. http://tinyurl.com/5m2s2d
(wordpressjob): New job posted! WordPress blog design http://tinyurl.com/6bvnr6
(AndyLenz): schönes neues design bei meinem neuen #twitter lieblingsdienst #twitturly http://twitturly.com/
(TheJoshuaTree): I dont know why, but every-time I listen to Design Matters With Debbie Millman, I feel like a carp designer
(Beaverdale): Drinking ACME pale ale just because I like the retro-y design of the label (but it is pretty darn good beer). Every day should be like this.
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Michael: interesting to compare your comment to that of Randy Holloway at http://randyh.wordpress.com/2008/05/18/the-news-is-in-the-noise/
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Michael: interesting to compare your comment to that of Randy Holloway at http://randyh.wordpress.com/2008/05/18/the-news-is-in-the-noise/
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> Scoble, you are utterly worthless.
Yo, Michael C… I find that I disagree with Scoble more often than I agree with him, but dude, what’s with the *personal* hate? Given that you clearly have no interest in, nay, actually can’t stand his commentary, why read it? The Internet’s a grand, big, and flexible place. Find some corners you like and perhaps save on blood pressure medication 🙂
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> Scoble, you are utterly worthless.
Yo, Michael C… I find that I disagree with Scoble more often than I agree with him, but dude, what’s with the *personal* hate? Given that you clearly have no interest in, nay, actually can’t stand his commentary, why read it? The Internet’s a grand, big, and flexible place. Find some corners you like and perhaps save on blood pressure medication 🙂
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Thank you, Robert.
“Noise” before the China quake? Does that mean you are really a Princeton Egg in disguise?
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Thank you, Robert.
“Noise” before the China quake? Does that mean you are really a Princeton Egg in disguise?
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Who cares if you knew about the China earthquake before the US new media? There were people in China who knew before you. Who cares.
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Who cares if you knew about the China earthquake before the US new media? There were people in China who knew before you. Who cares.
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BTW scoble, I discovered google.com 45 minutes before you did. Who cares. So you were interviewed on bozo US news media. Millions of people in Asia knew about the earthquake before you. Why don’t you search for extraterrestrial life or something useful?
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BTW scoble, I discovered google.com 45 minutes before you did. Who cares. So you were interviewed on bozo US news media. Millions of people in Asia knew about the earthquake before you. Why don’t you search for extraterrestrial life or something useful?
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Noise is wonderfully useful to get the latest news. I’m attempting a method to filter out the noise to get the news from across the web without actually using/relying on a specific service like Twitter.
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Noise is wonderfully useful to get the latest news. I’m attempting a method to filter out the noise to get the news from across the web without actually using/relying on a specific service like Twitter.
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Andy Beard’s comment is right. Robert’s reply to Andy is wrong. Robert, techmeme.com/lb is an output, not an input. And there are many, many blogs whose links send juice/love/rank equal to TechCrunch’s.
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Andy Beard’s comment is right. Robert’s reply to Andy is wrong. Robert, techmeme.com/lb is an output, not an input. And there are many, many blogs whose links send juice/love/rank equal to TechCrunch’s.
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Interesting take on noise vs news. I’ve always been an information junkie, a mix of noise and news I guess. I enjoy skimming through numerous blog posts and info bits from Twitter each day. I also enjoy magazine articles – things that aren’t time sensitive – that go behind the scenes or look over the horizon for trends. And when I can, I do a quick scan of thousands of press release headlines each week (PR Newswire & Business Wire) – kind of like a PR Twitter stream. All of it together helps me get a feel for trends and shifts in the digital/business landscape. Finding out how Zappos, for example, is using Twitter so effectively tells me we’ll see more Brands jumping on the Twitter train soon.
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Interesting take on noise vs news. I’ve always been an information junkie, a mix of noise and news I guess. I enjoy skimming through numerous blog posts and info bits from Twitter each day. I also enjoy magazine articles – things that aren’t time sensitive – that go behind the scenes or look over the horizon for trends. And when I can, I do a quick scan of thousands of press release headlines each week (PR Newswire & Business Wire) – kind of like a PR Twitter stream. All of it together helps me get a feel for trends and shifts in the digital/business landscape. Finding out how Zappos, for example, is using Twitter so effectively tells me we’ll see more Brands jumping on the Twitter train soon.
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Don’t lose site of the difference between why you trawl the noise and why some of us subscribe to your output. There is very little value for me in getting the mere fact of the existence of an earthquake a few minutes before someone else. I’m certainly not subscribed to your feeds for geological information.
It’s kinda interesting to confirm that the Internet has become real-time – but it’s been real-time for years now – twitter just makes it easier to notice.
The greatest service any noise trawler can provide me is to filter the noise. Your filter is your value proposition. Be very careful how you play with the filter’s settings.
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Don’t lose site of the difference between why you trawl the noise and why some of us subscribe to your output. There is very little value for me in getting the mere fact of the existence of an earthquake a few minutes before someone else. I’m certainly not subscribed to your feeds for geological information.
It’s kinda interesting to confirm that the Internet has become real-time – but it’s been real-time for years now – twitter just makes it easier to notice.
The greatest service any noise trawler can provide me is to filter the noise. Your filter is your value proposition. Be very careful how you play with the filter’s settings.
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You’ve hung out with the world’s top journalists? Really? Which ones?
Walt Bogdanich, or Jake Hooker? Amy Harmon? Jo Becker ? Barton Gellman? Steve Fainaru? Gene Weingarten? Steven Pearlstein? Brett Blackledge? Kenneth Weiss? Usha Lee McFarling?
Susan Schmidt? James Grimaldi?, R. Jeffrey Smith? Dana Priest? James Risen? Eric Lichtblau? Joseph Kahn? jim Yardley? Dele Olojede?
If you are going to make such a bold claim, at least name some names.
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You’ve hung out with the world’s top journalists? Really? Which ones?
Walt Bogdanich, or Jake Hooker? Amy Harmon? Jo Becker ? Barton Gellman? Steve Fainaru? Gene Weingarten? Steven Pearlstein? Brett Blackledge? Kenneth Weiss? Usha Lee McFarling?
Susan Schmidt? James Grimaldi?, R. Jeffrey Smith? Dana Priest? James Risen? Eric Lichtblau? Joseph Kahn? jim Yardley? Dele Olojede?
If you are going to make such a bold claim, at least name some names.
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And Ted Kennedy’s family and friends new about his seizure before you did. What’s your point?
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And Ted Kennedy’s family and friends new about his seizure before you did. What’s your point?
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this is just basic communication theory.
information -> transmitter -> communication channel -> receiver
The channel acts as a filter.
You are pointing out that Google News acts as a filter prior to the transmission as their methodology slects only “reputable” or “highly regarded” information sources.
I’m guessing that most readers of your blog, greater social/online network, possess sufficient receiver processing power to parse the noise, so therefore they desire a high bandwidth transmitter and communication channel.
However, I don’t believe that everyone wishes to do the receiver post-processing and often prefer news which is easier to digest.
thanks for the post
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this is just basic communication theory.
information -> transmitter -> communication channel -> receiver
The channel acts as a filter.
You are pointing out that Google News acts as a filter prior to the transmission as their methodology slects only “reputable” or “highly regarded” information sources.
I’m guessing that most readers of your blog, greater social/online network, possess sufficient receiver processing power to parse the noise, so therefore they desire a high bandwidth transmitter and communication channel.
However, I don’t believe that everyone wishes to do the receiver post-processing and often prefer news which is easier to digest.
thanks for the post
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If I were a real news junkie then I’d go for the noise. I’d be willing to expend the energy required to spot trends and basically keep up with the noise. As it is, I’m not willing, which is why news is usually enough for me. I only want to keep up enough to consume the strained, filtered and processed product.
If I may use a crude analogy: It’s like having someone else masticate my food before I eat it. I lose out on the nutrients and most of the enjoyment. (Not to mention it’s disgusting.) But it saves me the trouble of having to chew. If I had the time or energy or willingness, then of course I’d rather do it myself.
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If I were a real news junkie then I’d go for the noise. I’d be willing to expend the energy required to spot trends and basically keep up with the noise. As it is, I’m not willing, which is why news is usually enough for me. I only want to keep up enough to consume the strained, filtered and processed product.
If I may use a crude analogy: It’s like having someone else masticate my food before I eat it. I lose out on the nutrients and most of the enjoyment. (Not to mention it’s disgusting.) But it saves me the trouble of having to chew. If I had the time or energy or willingness, then of course I’d rather do it myself.
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as a professional, seasoned print journalist, i’d like to tell your readers you are full of crap. a tour of a newspaper’s satellite printing plant does not mean you have “hung out” with top journalists. sorry to use this language, but you are somewhat pathetic. as a simple example, a real journalist knows the difference between “who” and “that,” or at least his or her editor does. you really don’t have a bit of a handle on the news business. your prime sources of daily news are on the bottom rung of information. just what are you trying to achieve? from what i see, you, as with most of americans, haven’t the foggiest idea about what news is or what the news business is about. you might want to give it up. while you’re at it, review some of your 7th grade grammar lessons.
and sorry, steve, you didn’t list a single “real journalist.” most of the best are not readily known to the general public because we don’t seek tabloid-cable tv attention.
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as a professional, seasoned print journalist, i’d like to tell your readers you are full of crap. a tour of a newspaper’s satellite printing plant does not mean you have “hung out” with top journalists. sorry to use this language, but you are somewhat pathetic. as a simple example, a real journalist knows the difference between “who” and “that,” or at least his or her editor does. you really don’t have a bit of a handle on the news business. your prime sources of daily news are on the bottom rung of information. just what are you trying to achieve? from what i see, you, as with most of americans, haven’t the foggiest idea about what news is or what the news business is about. you might want to give it up. while you’re at it, review some of your 7th grade grammar lessons.
and sorry, steve, you didn’t list a single “real journalist.” most of the best are not readily known to the general public because we don’t seek tabloid-cable tv attention.
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Since noise is where the future trends and actions hide, wouldn’t it be interesting to implement that behaviour in regular business. Thinking of NPM Noise Process Management as a challenge for companies.
http://bpmedge.wordpress.com
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Since noise is where the future trends and actions hide, wouldn’t it be interesting to implement that behaviour in regular business. Thinking of NPM Noise Process Management as a challenge for companies.
http://bpmedge.wordpress.com
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its quite cool without noise :d
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its quite cool without noise :d
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Fantastic analysis and explanation of the two, Robert.
Really insightful. Great job.
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Fantastic analysis and explanation of the two, Robert.
Really insightful. Great job.
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hurah for the noise. nicely written.
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hurah for the noise. nicely written.
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straightrecord, fair point about my list of named. I completely agree that the majority of the world’s best journalists go unknown. Which only reinforces my question that Scoble provide evidence to support his narccistic claim
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straightrecord, fair point about my list of named. I completely agree that the majority of the world’s best journalists go unknown. Which only reinforces my question that Scoble provide evidence to support his narccistic claim
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I am wondering what advantage did anyone gain by virtue of all of the early “Noise” generated about the earthquake on Twitter. Did anyone use this information to take any action what so ever to help anyone or did you all just congratulate each other for knowing first….
Noise is for twits news is for people who are too busy doing things that matter to have time to sift thrugh the noise.
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I am wondering what advantage did anyone gain by virtue of all of the early “Noise” generated about the earthquake on Twitter. Did anyone use this information to take any action what so ever to help anyone or did you all just congratulate each other for knowing first….
Noise is for twits news is for people who are too busy doing things that matter to have time to sift thrugh the noise.
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Noise as you call it can be a way of quickly receiving what is practically just the latest news, but on the other hand it usually is also highly inaccurate as details have yet to be revealed.
An indication that something happened which is getting people’s attention but it’s usually not till the actual news arrives before people really get to know what it’s about.
Asides from that, don’t forget that essentially most noise is just coming from the news directly, quickly mentioned by one which happened to be watching the news. It’s not like it instantly came from those right at the source of things.
In case you have the time on your hands though to follow what’s happening in the world by doing so on services like twitter, blogs or any other form of independent journalism on the net nothing is going to stop you. But for those with less time on their hands google news is all they need, or perhaps better to say what they can spare.
On the other hand, noise is far from a bad thing either. Not that I give anything on whether someone knows it before me or not, but simply for the fact that it creates awareness. After all, better to pick up the latest news through the noise than not picking it up at all.
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Noise as you call it can be a way of quickly receiving what is practically just the latest news, but on the other hand it usually is also highly inaccurate as details have yet to be revealed.
An indication that something happened which is getting people’s attention but it’s usually not till the actual news arrives before people really get to know what it’s about.
Asides from that, don’t forget that essentially most noise is just coming from the news directly, quickly mentioned by one which happened to be watching the news. It’s not like it instantly came from those right at the source of things.
In case you have the time on your hands though to follow what’s happening in the world by doing so on services like twitter, blogs or any other form of independent journalism on the net nothing is going to stop you. But for those with less time on their hands google news is all they need, or perhaps better to say what they can spare.
On the other hand, noise is far from a bad thing either. Not that I give anything on whether someone knows it before me or not, but simply for the fact that it creates awareness. After all, better to pick up the latest news through the noise than not picking it up at all.
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Oh, I love this post. It’s the difference between process and product, in therapyspeak.
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Oh, I love this post. It’s the difference between process and product, in therapyspeak.
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Noise should be avoided. Typically, noise is poorly written. Editors are undervalued. If you read a large volume of noise, your writing will suffer. Filters, such as Google News, help.
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Noise should be avoided. Typically, noise is poorly written. Editors are undervalued. If you read a large volume of noise, your writing will suffer. Filters, such as Google News, help.
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There are some GREAT comments here!
That NOISE is the sound of ideas being formed as the Internet moves; it’s to be embraced by those who want to see the future in advance!
I just wrote a post about Robert’s influence on my blog. It’s about time he gets the ‘props’ he deserves – what Scoble’s achieved in amazing – stunning. http://thetechnewsblog.com/2008/05/19/the-scoble-effect/
Jim Connolly
The Tech News Blog
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There are some GREAT comments here!
That NOISE is the sound of ideas being formed as the Internet moves; it’s to be embraced by those who want to see the future in advance!
I just wrote a post about Robert’s influence on my blog. It’s about time he gets the ‘props’ he deserves – what Scoble’s achieved in amazing – stunning. http://thetechnewsblog.com/2008/05/19/the-scoble-effect/
Jim Connolly
The Tech News Blog
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noise
n.
1) A stench in the ear. Undomesticated music. The chief product and authenticating sign of civilization.
2)In Computer Science, irrelevant or meaningless data.
1)Devil’s Dictionary
2)American Heritage Dictionary
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noise
n.
1) A stench in the ear. Undomesticated music. The chief product and authenticating sign of civilization.
2)In Computer Science, irrelevant or meaningless data.
1)Devil’s Dictionary
2)American Heritage Dictionary
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The noise of Twitter and Friendfeed are interesting to you because you’re writing about Twitter and Friendfeed. It wouldn’t be any use to anyone who doesn’t cover those areas. You sound to me like an old-time newsman who advises a youngster to hang around the police station because that’s where it’s all happening. Well, on the crime beat that’s good advice. But what if you cover City Hall?
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The noise of Twitter and Friendfeed are interesting to you because you’re writing about Twitter and Friendfeed. It wouldn’t be any use to anyone who doesn’t cover those areas. You sound to me like an old-time newsman who advises a youngster to hang around the police station because that’s where it’s all happening. Well, on the crime beat that’s good advice. But what if you cover City Hall?
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So… what would happen if politicians start listening to the noise instead of to the news (and big statistic reports and such)
And…
What would happen when corporate companies start listening to the noise instead of to the news? Oh.. a… wait… I guess that’s called marketing or maybe customer service but what are the executives doing?
I am sure one day that -will- happen. But not today. And not tomorrow.
😉
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So… what would happen if politicians start listening to the noise instead of to the news (and big statistic reports and such)
And…
What would happen when corporate companies start listening to the noise instead of to the news? Oh.. a… wait… I guess that’s called marketing or maybe customer service but what are the executives doing?
I am sure one day that -will- happen. But not today. And not tomorrow.
😉
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Hey there, i don't think so, what makes you say that btw!
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Hey there, i don't think so, what makes you say that btw!
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